MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
Every time a presidential transition takes place, a familiar phrase crops up - the U.S. has one president at a time. The outgoing president still calls the shots until the new president is sworn in. However, President-elect Trump is already declaring specific foreign policy plans that differ from those of President Biden. For more on this, we're joined by NPR's Greg Myre. Hi, Greg.
GREG MYRE, BYLINE: Hi, Mary Louise.
KELLY: What specific foreign policy plans is Trump outlining?
MYRE: Well, this week, Trump went on social media and demanded that the Palestinian group Hamas release Israeli hostages and several American Israeli hostages before Trump is sworn in on January 20. If they aren't freed, he said, there will be hell to pay and those responsible will be hit harder than anybody has been hit in U.S. history. Now, the Biden administration has been trying unsuccessfully to negotiate a ceasefire and hostage release in the Gaza war. I spoke to Julian Zelizer, a historian at Princeton. I asked him if Trump's approach may produce a breakthrough or just make things more complicated for Biden.
JULIAN ZELIZER: That will depend on outcomes. If his doing this somehow moves unmovable leaders on issues, that would be a good thing. But we don't know if it will work out that way. He obviously could also end up subverting Biden.
KELLY: Greg Myre, I'm sitting here trying to think of parallels, and I'm wondering about 1981. Jimmy Carter was president. He was leaving the White House. He was trying to win the release of U.S. hostages being held in Iran before Ronald Reagan walked into the White House. What happened?
MYRE: Yeah, that's right. There are some similarities. The U.S. hostages were held for more than a year. And Carter's team worked at a deal just before he was set to leave office. It looked like he might leave on a high note, but as Zelizer notes...
ZELIZER: The Iranians did not want to give him a victory, though. And they actually released the hostages right after Ronald Reagan is inaugurated. There's a split screen moment where the inauguration is happening, the hostages are being released. And ultimately, it's a great triumph for Reagan.
KELLY: How might tariffs fit into this? Because Trump is also saying, Day 1, he's going to slap tariffs on China, Mexico, Canada. Is he already negotiating?
MYRE: You know, Mary Louise, right after these comments, the Canadian and Mexican leaders very quickly got in contact with Trump. Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau even made the trek to Mar-a-Lago in Florida, so Trump's remarks clearly had an impact. Now, Trump supporters may say this is a very good thing. These countries know they're on notice and need to be ready for Trump's concern. Some critics say this goes against the principle that an incoming president should wait until he's in office before dealing with substantive policies. And during the transition period, you'd expect congratulatory courtesy calls from foreign leaders, but not policy discussions over punitive measures, especially with friendly neighbors like Canada and Mexico.
KELLY: What about Ukraine, which is where one can imagine one of the biggest foreign policy changes between Trump and Biden?
MYRE: Well, Trump has already spoken with Ukraine's leader, Volodymyr Zelenskyy. Elon Musk even joined in on that call. And we know Trump wants to negotiate an end to the war. He even claimed during the campaign he could do that in a day. Now, that's really seen as bluster. But we should note, Zelenskyy has struck a slightly different tone recently. He now says Ukraine could agree to a ceasefire if it's allowed to join NATO. Big ifs there. And, Mary Louise, one last note. Trump is taking on some of the ceremonial trappings of the presidency. He's heading to Paris this weekend to attend the reopening of Notre Dame Cathedral. It's been restored after it was badly damaged in a fire five years ago. Not surprisingly, Trump will meet with his soon-to-be counterpart, French President Emmanuel Macron.
KELLY: Thank you, Greg.
MYRE: Sure thing.
KELLY: NPR's Greg Myre. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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